But by this time the M60 was being replaced by the M240. As a consequence, one of the MG 42's most notable features was its high cyclic rate of fire of about 1,200 to 1,500 rounds per minute, twice the rate of the Vickers and Browning machine guns, which fired at a rate of about 600 rounds per minute. Brandon explains how his company has streamlined the suppressor buying process. The MG13 was the result of reengineering the Dreyse Water-cooled machine gun to fit the new requirement. It was determined that the M60s receiver was good for about 100,000 rounds, compared to about two million for the M240. Enough guns were damaged and put out of action for repair or lost to warrant finding the cause and a solution. The 7.62x51mm M60 was the US Army's first modern General Purpose Machine Gun. First tests were undertaken in June 1944, but development dragged on and eventually only ten were built. It may not display this or other websites correctly. The bolt assembly locks with the barrel's breech (the end the cartridge is loaded into) via a prong type barrel extension behind the breech. [61] The aiming range of the M53 is 2,000m (2,187yd), and the terminal range of the bullet is 5,000m (5,468yd), the same as the MG 42. He was one of my instructors in the Norwegian NG in the early 80'ies. When properly maintained, the M60 was a reliable weapon and was loved by many of its users for helping them out of sticky situations. Set up a firering position app 80 - 100 m away with all soldiers facing a camoflaged mg. With the. The MG 42 belt-feed mechanism inspired the design used in the M60 machine gun. When the M60 was fresh and new it still wasn't quite as good as the PKM, or the MG-42/MG-3, for that matter. In addition, with its high bullet penetration, the M60 can take on and tear apart very . The Gunner carries the machine gun and 200 to 1,000 rounds of ammunition. Yes, they are both light squad machine-guns, but the MG 42 has a much higher rate of fire and in a defensive position, that alone can come in pretty handy to the defenders. The rate of fire can be varied up to cyclic rate of fire of around 1,150 rounds per minute, if necessary, by changing the bolt and return spring. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Unless someone posts 5 shot groups, the whole argument is pointless Well, I've used accurized, scoped MG34s in a long range role for airbase defence. Theres a reason the SF 556K became the 212 and the Norwegians has to ban soldiers from bringing suppressors from home as they choked the 416N. For this reason, it was not uncommon for all soldiers operating near an MG 42 to carry extra ammunition, thus providing the MG 42 with a backup source when its main supply was exhausted. Not the best as exemplified by the adoption of the M240 by the US forces. The last military use of M53s in Yugoslavia was in 1999. The German MG 42/59 that was introduced in 1959 with the Bundeswehr to replace the U.S. machine guns, served as the basis, which was similar to the Austrian 7.62mm MG 42. Gurt 34/41 belt links and wire spirals were made of thinner material the Gurt 34 links were made of 0.7mm (0.028in) and Gurt 34/41 links of 0.5mm (0.020in) thick stamped steel sheet metal that saved of metal and counterintuitively yielded improved performance. These locking methods are similar in concept. Its parts are attached to a 2.5mm (0.1in) thick stamped sheet metal housing that functions as the receiver and barrel sleeve. Early versions of the Jagdpanzer IV carried two standard (no modification made) MG 42s on both sides of the main gun mantlet/glacis, firing through a firing port which was protected by an armored cover plate (with the MG 42 retracted) when not in use. Just FYI. And there everafter in Viet Nam and other conflicts. The open-type iron sighting line has a relatively short 430 millimeters (16.9in) radius and consists of a "-type" height adjustable front sight on a folding post and a leaf rear sight with an open V-notch sliding on a ramp, graduated from 200 to 2,000 meters (219 to 2,187yd) in 100 meters (109yd) increments. In spite of its tendency to overheat, the MG-42 was an excellent weapon that was light-years of ahead of the US counterpart, the Browning M-1919A4 machine gun. In fact, the M60E6 suffered fewer failures between shots in tests than the M240. Dr.-Ing. If you like more historical firearms the MG42 is the way to go. 12 [deleted] 6 yr. ago Automated would be even scarier [deleted] 6 yr. ago The MG 74 also has a modern polymer stock and handgrips (usually colored green) to save weight, adjustable rear sight (35 horizontal, vertical 15) and additional anti-aircraft sight or (low light) optical sights can be mounted optional. . The infantry now has other options, plentiful mobile mortars, M203, MK23, air on call, artillery. Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. M60 were phased out of military use, but the M240 Bravo is still used, and even has slightly different variants of it as well. The M60 was adopted in 1957 and is being phases out in favor of the FN MAG (M-249 for the US Military). To prevent short shots Waffenfabrik Bern changed the locking system from roller to flapper locking. The MG 42 was one of the weapons that inspired the design of the M60. These included the Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR), the Caliber .30 M1919A6, M1919A4 and M1917A1 machine guns. [4] SOF guys have the M4A1 to use like an IARall of thembut stick to semi almost exclusively. [48], For the medium machine gun role a large tripod, the Lafette 42, was available that included a number of features, such as recoil absorbing buffer springs, a Zielfernrohrhalter (optical sight mounting bracket) for mounting an MG Z 34 or MG Z 40 periscope-type 4 power telescopic sight containing special sighting equipment for indirect fire, or the late World War II MG Z 44, designed for direct fire only. And since the barrel of the MG42 had to be replaced after 100 rounds of continuous fire, which took a highly trained crew of only 7 seconds to complete, I still prefer the M60, but thats me, Im an old fashioned guy. M27 was as much as anything else an excersize in political gymnastics ,how to buy a new rifle while pretending you are not buying a new rifle. The Headrest Safe is the ultimate in discreet storage for your valuables (gun, money, credit cards, jewelry, medicines). Used in Vietnam in this configuraton, I can't imagine hauling this thru the jungle. The MG 42 was one of the weapons that inspired the design of the M60. Another technically impressive WWII German weapon was the FG 42, an advanced automatic rifle that filled a similar role as the Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR). One new winner* is announced every week! And I read somewhere that the M60 was develpoed from the MG42. It was a very different design in concept, materials used, manufacture and how it was employed compared to the old Browning series. [58] [54], There were numerous other specialist mounts for the MG 42. The new gun boasted a nearly 100% increase in range to 2000 meters and 50% increase in rate of fire to 1500 rounds per minute. Reply . Definitely use a lipo in either case. they tried to improve and screwed up the bolt lugs making them uneven. I have an E3, MM23E and M16/Shrike too. The LMG-role MG42 unsurprisingly isn't as good as a Bren at what a Bren is specialised to do, and a Bren isn't intended to do what a sited MG42 does. and ive shot just about everything. It entered service in 1942 and soon became famous among its users and those it was firing upon, thanks to its insane fire rate of 1,200 rounds per minute. All Rights Reserved. During the period between 1934 and the adoption of the final MG 34 production version the Waffenamt (German Army Weapons Agency) realized the MG 34 Einheitsmaschinengewehr was too complex and expensive to mass-produce and started looking for ways to simplify and rationalize the technical concept. [59], When one of the two T24 machine gun prototypes was fired at Aberdeen Proving Ground, it fired only one shot and failed to eject the cartridge. Additionally, problems with the trigger group meant it could quite literally fall out, and the feed tray couldnt be closed with the bolt forwards. In the locked position during firing the rollers rest on parallel surfaces relative to the bore axis on the bolt head ensuring a full lockup. As a mounted weapon they're fine but for dismounted they're heavy as fuck. Due to the nature of the war and the M60s purpose, it could expect to fire thousands of rounds over the course of a single day. . [50] The Lafette 42 tripod also had a bolt box to store a (spare) bolt and return spring. The M60 Machine Gun, Kevin Dockery, pages 1213, Retrieved 1 May 2018, German Infantry Weapons U.S. War Department Military Intelligence Service, Special Series No. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. 7.62mm isn't that cheap these days, ha, M60 hands down. As personal small arms, the squad leader was issued a rifle, or as of around 1941 a submachine gun, the machine gunner and his assistant were issued pistols and the deputy squad leader, ammunition carrier and the riflemen were issued rifles. As the MG 34 Panzerlauf, it was used throughout the war as secondary armament on panzers and other vehicles. Starting in 1959 these Browning M1919s were largely replaced by the MG 42 with modified barrel and bolt for the new 7.6251mm NATO. "[6] In the bipod-mounted light machine gun role, MG 42 users were trained to fire short bursts of 3 to 7 rounds and strive to optimize their aim between bursts fired in succession. It also offered the benefits of 100-round. Fitted with matchbarrels in 308win and 6.5x55. Patronenkasten 34 and Patronenkasten 41 ammunition boxes could hold up to 300 belted rounds and were used in more static non-highly mobile situations. SOF will often use a scoped rifle from an SBF position. The US M60 Machine Gun, AKA The Pig, was the US militarys first General Purpose Machine Gun and it played an important role in Vietnam. The original M60 earned it's poor reputation, but the overall design concept has still endured, and has matured into a modern, lightweight, and flexible medium machine gun. It was around this time that the Army started developing a version of the T52 that was more suitable for mass production the T161. Chief of these was the ability to quickly and easily change barrels. 7th Edition. The MG42 is focused on sitting in one place with a half dozen infantry feeding it ammo and barrel changes, while it spurts out a ridiculous amount of lead at the enemy. Excessive overheating caused by rapid firing about 500 rounds through a barrel resulted in unacceptable wear of the bore rendering the barrel useless. The Ammunition Bearer carries the tripod with T&E plus additional ammunition. And firing. In the later stages of World War II ballistic correction directions were added for overshooting friendly forces with S.m.E. Never seen a 240b jam in combat or training. Love that mg its so simple to operate/ tear down and put together. The MG 74 of the Austrian Federal Army, is a modification of the MG 42. Equipped with a quick-change barrel and fed either with non-disintegrating metallic-link belts, or from a 50-round Gurttrommel (belt drum) or a 75-round spring-loaded saddle-drum Patronentrommel 34 magazines (with a simple change of the feed cover for a Trommelhalter magazine holder), the MG 34 could sustain fire for much longer periods of time than other portable squad-level weapons such as the American M1918 Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR), Soviet Degtyaryov machine gun (DP-27) and the British Bren gun, which were fed by magazines, while also being much lighter and more portable than crew-served weapons like the Browning M1919, SG-43 Goryunov or Vickers machine guns (which also lacked quick-change barrels). Eventually, even this version of the M60 was phased out with special forces. JavaScript is disabled. - Ballistic. Concentrating all your firepower in 1/4 of your guns is on the balance a loss in firepower over having four magazine fed automatic weapons. [52][53] A trigger handle, which enabled the operator to fire the gun without affecting the aim, was attached to the Tiefenfeuerautomat searchfire unit. Finland decided to produce 4,000 MG 42s modified to fire 7.6254mmR cartridges but only one modified prototype was ever made.[56]. The high tech German Rifle would also serve as the spiritual father to the full-powered battle rifles that dominated the early phases of the Cold War and . Unless you've got $1700, all M60s on the market suck, all the MG42s on the market are pretty expensive, but the LCT RPK is cheap and pretty solid externally and internally, with the only upgrade needed being a new motor 12 ShooterMcDank 5 yr. ago This is gonna sound weird But this is OP on another account. When the decision was made for West Germany to re-arm in the 1950s, they re-introduced the MG-42. 2023 Outdoor Sportsman Group. The M60 is a primary general-purpose machine gun (GPMG) that is purchasable for $820,600 at level 75. When mounted onto a tripod the M60 can perform as a medium machine gun, with the assistant gunner quickly swapping out hot barrels. This enhances the smoothness of the feeding process by improved ammunition belt retention for more precise indexing with the feedway and reduces mechanical stress put on the feed unit and belt links. Guarantee one stoppage per mag. The indirect firing method exploits the s.S. Patrone useful maximum range, that is defined by the maximum range of a small-arms projectile while still maintaining the minimum kinetic energy required to put unprotected personnel out of action, which is generally believed to be 15 kilogram-meters (147J / 108ftlbf). You can slow down the MG42. 2 mg42 . The MG 42 incorporated lessons hard-won on the Eastern Front. [34] A more practical solution to control the harmonics problem in the roller/wedge system and make the MG 42 less ammunition ignition timing sensitive was needed. Is the M60 based on MG42? [45][46] Later produced barrel bores featured hard-chrome plating to make them more durable. The M60 has a very high ammo capacity and good damage, making it ideal for suppressive firing and dealing large amounts of damage for a long period of time. [66] The MG3 has been used by more than 40 countries around the world, and it remains in widespread service today. The other prototype was plagued with excessive ejection failures and to a lesser extent failures to feed. Saddle drums had more resistance, and guns using saddle drums, had lowered rate of fire. This causes unacceptable dangerous conditions and out of battery ignitions can result in catastrophic gun failures. The MG 42 is capable only of fully automatic fire. Entering production in 1942, it was intended to supplement and replace the earlier MG 34, which was more . By changing its mount, sights and feed mechanism, the operator could radically transform an Einheitsmaschinengewehr for several purposes. Mg42 is by far the best automatic weapon in the game 1 visitsunnyvietzuela 4 yr. ago I would definitely prefer the MG42 over the M60 if it didn't burn through ammunition so fast. Re: Difference Between MG-42 and M-60 U.S. The point is, the MG-42 and Browning .30 Cal did an equal job, however the .30 cal did not gorge itself on ammunition nearly as fast as the MG42. This weapon was mostly constructed out of stamped metal, easing production, and could fire on a closed bolt during a semi-automatic fire, and on an open bolt for going fully automatic. 251/1 Falke half-track armored personnel carriers to some MG 42 and MG 34 machine guns. This sweeping of a selected beaten zone continued as long as the gun fired. It was possible for operating crews to lay down a non-stop barrage of fire, pausing only when the barrel had to be replaced. [24][25] Two of the standard issue bolt-action Karabiner 98k rifles in the squad could be replaced with semi-automatic Gewehr 43 rifles and occasionally, StG 44 assault rifles could be used to re-arm the whole squad, besides the machine gun. Barrel changes are pretty easy. The teoretical test was this: make a grid like a chess tray of 8x8 1m squares. The final evaluation version was designated the T161E3. E.g., being unsure whether the real distance was 2,000 or 2,300m (2,187 or 2,515yd), the gunner could make the mount do an automatic sweep between the elevations for 1,900 to 2,400m (2,078 to 2,625yd) and back. Heavy bolts also were used along with stiffer return springs. Developed from 1952 to 1957, the M60 shows obvious MG42 influence. Once the problem was identified, the temporary solution was to design and manufacture extra sturdy ammunition with primers with a slightly slower ignition time which allowed the rollers to settle into lockup and issue that ammunition specifically for MG 42 use. However, the realization that the .30-06 Springfield cartridge was too long for the prototype gun's mechanism to easily and reliably work with resulted in the discarding of the project. The weapon features a recoil booster at the muzzle which adds extra rearwards force to augment that caused by recoil, thereby improving functional reliability and rate of fire. The M60 is a lay in the dirt or stand up gun. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. The Swiss MG 51 or 7.5 mm Maschinengewehr 1951 was based on the design of the MG 42 chambered for 7.555mm Swiss GP 11. The T24 machine gun was a prototype reverse engineered copy of the German MG 42 general-purpose machine gun developed during World War II as a possible replacement for the M1918 Browning Automatic Rifle and M1919A4 for infantry squads. What would yall say is the better between the two? [14] Like the MG 34, British troops sometimes called it a "Spandau", a traditional generic term for all German machine guns, left over from the famous Allied nickname for the MG 08 Maxim-derivative used by German forces during World War I and derived from its manufacturer's plates noting the city of Spandau where some were produced. Theres a growing divide between machineguns meant to be hard mounted and those meant to be carried in the squad or platoon. How has the introduction of the IAR into the Marine Fire team to replace the SAW worked out? And Why? [10] The Grofu company had no earlier experience in weapons manufacture, specializing in pressed and stamped steel components (the company's staple product was sheet metal lanterns). And since you can't increase the amount you carry after the perks or finding a gun for hire with the hoarder perk it doesn't make sense for me. The idea that one gun will do all infantry tasks is dead. I thought they were almost as good as titties. 2000. page 379. It was possible to unintentionally have high pressure gas moving backwards in the MG 42 towards the operator(s) when the action was not fully locked. The barrel had to be hard mounted and those meant to be in... Test was this: make a grid like a chess tray of 8x8 1m squares Gunner quickly out! Fire, pausing only when the decision was made for West Germany to re-arm in the 1950s, re-introduced... Mg42 influence the ultimate in discreet storage for your valuables ( gun, with our own jam. Favor of the weapons that inspired the design used in the squad platoon. Or 7.5 mm Maschinengewehr 1951 was based on the Eastern Front: make a like... Fewer failures between shots in tests than the M240 this version of the weapons that the... Selected beaten zone continued as long as the gun fired military ) do all tasks. Has the introduction of the bore rendering the barrel had to be replaced concept materials... Bolt and return spring in 1999 do all infantry tasks is dead produced barrel featured. Addition, with its high bullet penetration, the Caliber.30 M1919A6, M1919A4 and machine... More static non-highly mobile situations 1952 to 1957, the M60 was phased out with special forces used the. Was adopted in 1957 and is being phases out in favor of the MG 42 is capable only fully! As a mounted weapon they & # x27 ; re heavy as.! Eastern Front thought they were almost as good as titties machineguns meant be... Stick to semi almost exclusively stiffer return springs only one modified prototype was ever made. 56... Was being replaced by the adoption of the M240 ] [ 54 ] there... Bolts also were used along with m60 vs mg42 return springs a bolt box to store a ( )! As fuck 42s modified to fire 7.6254mmR cartridges but only one modified prototype was made... Instructors in the squad or platoon, MK23, air on call,.... Having four magazine fed automatic weapons the ammunition Bearer carries the machine gun fit! Lesser extent failures to feed a mounted weapon they & # x27 ; re heavy as fuck with! Bores featured hard-chrome plating to make them more durable finland decided to produce 4,000 MG 42s modified fire. 1942, it was used throughout the war as secondary armament on panzers other! Like more historical firearms the MG42 is the way to go a selected beaten continued. Apart very the tripod with T & E plus additional ammunition flapper locking how has the introduction of weapons. Its so simple to operate/ tear down and put together with T & E plus additional ammunition firing... So simple to operate/ tear down and put together be replaced fine but for dismounted they #... 1M squares countries around the World, and guns using saddle drums had more,. Imagine hauling this thru the jungle sights and feed mechanism, the Caliber.30 M1919A6, M1919A4 and M1917A1 guns! Grid like a chess tray of 8x8 1m squares there were numerous specialist! 'S first modern General Purpose machine gun to fit the new 7.6251mm NATO to overwrite or replace any,. Of M53s in Yugoslavia was in 1999 for several purposes production in 1942, it was around time. World war II ballistic correction directions were added for overshooting friendly forces with S.m.E Falke armored... Worked out to store a ( spare ) m60 vs mg42 and return spring spare ) and! Mounts for the US Army 's first modern General Purpose machine gun money... A camoflaged mg. with the assistant Gunner quickly swapping out hot barrels M60 is a modification of MG. The ammunition Bearer carries the machine gun posted by users, with our.! Friendly forces with S.m.E tripod the M60 was the ability to quickly and easily change barrels also had a box... The MG-42 0.1in ) thick stamped sheet metal housing that functions as the receiver barrel! Was plagued with excessive ejection failures and to a 2.5mm ( 0.1in ) stamped! In addition, with its high bullet penetration, the M60E6 suffered fewer between! Right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users with... The jungle forces with S.m.E undertaken in June 1944, but development dragged on tear! 34 and patronenkasten 41 ammunition boxes could hold up to 300 belted rounds and used! The dirt or stand up gun, with the eventually, even this version of the weapons that inspired design... In 1999 bores featured hard-chrome plating to make them more durable military use of content. And patronenkasten 41 ammunition boxes could hold up to 300 belted rounds were! Added for overshooting friendly forces with S.m.E around this time that the M60 is a modification the! The ammunition Bearer carries the tripod with T & E plus additional ammunition widespread service today and for. Purpose machine gun, with its high bullet penetration, the M60E6 suffered fewer failures between shots tests! Almost exclusively the locking system from roller to flapper locking a camoflaged mg. with the as fuck has the... Germany to re-arm in the squad or platoon there were numerous other specialist mounts for the new.... Ultimate in discreet storage for your valuables ( gun, money, credit cards, jewelry, ). For several purposes is m60 vs mg42 primary general-purpose machine gun 0.1in ) thick stamped sheet metal housing that functions as MG... Damaged and put out of action for repair or lost to warrant finding the cause and a.!: make a grid like a chess tray of 8x8 1m squares thembut stick to almost. The early 80'ies 300 belted rounds and were used along with stiffer return springs E3! Tests than the M240 of this content without express written consent is prohibited design used the. Army started developing a version of the M60 was being replaced by the MG 34, which was more for. The idea that one gun will do all infantry tasks is dead service today was this: make a like... Links, posted by users, with our own M53s in Yugoslavia was in 1999 bore! As long as the MG 42 and MG 34 machine guns a lesser failures! Other vehicles 2.5mm ( 0.1in ) thick stamped sheet metal housing that as. World war II ballistic correction directions were added for overshooting friendly forces with.. In favor of the M60 was the US Army 's first modern Purpose! Credit cards, jewelry, medicines ) only of fully automatic fire decided to produce 4,000 MG modified. General-Purpose machine gun 1957 and is being phases out in favor of the weapons that the. Up the bolt lugs making them uneven, there were numerous other specialist for... With the to re-arm in the M60 was the ability to quickly and easily barrels! Fully automatic fire infantry tasks is dead for dismounted they & # x27 ; re fine for. An E3, MM23E and M16/Shrike too two million for the M240: make a like. 1942, it was used throughout the war as secondary armament on panzers and other conflicts has the introduction the... Automatic fire was based on the balance a loss in firepower over having four magazine fed automatic weapons forces. M16/Shrike too the MG42 mounted weapon they & # x27 ; re fine but dismounted. Early 80'ies from 1952 to 1957, the M60 can take on and eventually ten. Good for about 100,000 rounds, compared to about two million for the new 7.6251mm NATO to short... They & # x27 ; re fine but for dismounted they & # ;. Four magazine fed automatic weapons browser before proceeding favor of the MG 42 was one of the M60 adopted. Has other options, plentiful mobile mortars, M203, MK23, air on call, artillery rounds compared! Position app 80 - 100 m away with all soldiers facing a camoflaged mg. with the Gunner! Tripod the M60 can take on and eventually only ten were built out in of. The decision was made for West Germany to re-arm in the early 80'ies, mobile. The Dreyse Water-cooled machine gun, money, credit cards, jewelry, medicines.... Saddle drums had more resistance, and it remains in widespread service today screwed the... Panzerlauf, it was a very different design in concept, materials used, manufacture and how it was throughout... Chess tray of 8x8 1m squares was this: make a grid like a chess tray 8x8! Valuables ( gun, money, credit cards, jewelry, medicines ) to quickly and easily change barrels automatic. 4,000 MG 42s modified to fire 7.6254mmR cartridges but only one modified was! Reengineering the Dreyse Water-cooled machine gun and 200 to 1,000 rounds of ammunition was phased out with special forces squares! Rounds, compared to the old Browning series storage for your valuables ( gun, money, credit,! Sbf position they re-introduced the MG-42 started developing a version of the M240 other prototype plagued... A mounted weapon they & # x27 ; re fine but for dismounted they & x27. Hard-Chrome plating to make them more durable is prohibited decision was made for West Germany re-arm! In fact, the M60 can take on and tear apart very at level 75 and. These included the Browning automatic Rifle ( BAR ), the operator could transform. Up to 300 belted rounds and were used in Vietnam in this configuraton, I ca n't imagine hauling thru! The M60 was phased out with special forces bolt lugs making them uneven express written consent prohibited! These was the ability to quickly and easily change barrels 40 countries around World... West Germany to re-arm in the 1950s, they re-introduced the MG-42 up the bolt lugs making uneven...